A few questions!

There are lots of rules you can break; so thats what happens a lot...
Kashoku
Posts: 18
https://cutt.ly/meble-kuchenne-wroclaw
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

I'm very familiar with the fruitarian diet(which is bad, because of protein malnutrition and no b12) which the WaiDiet makes up for... however, with the raw food diet, all the vegetables and nuts, oils and fruits, it says that anything alkaline is good for the digestive system basically.

You're saying plants are bad, what of the biochemistry behind it?

My biggest concern, however is meeting the % daily values of the nutrients and the calorie req. 150 lb male.

Also, how the hell do you find time to eat and drink every ½ hour, doesn't anybody work? Or have some pretty conflicting schedules?

Oh yeah, my other huge concern is, I read in another post about somebody buying crates of oranges, 1st, where do you get a crate of oranges? Maybe country specific? 2nd, how much money are we talking about?

I have a $200 food budget per month to work with, suggestions for a 100% complete way of life?

Does anybody get bored eating the same stuff?

Thanks for any information!
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

Oh, what's with all the sugar use to?

White sugar? Or cane sugar...
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

Also, THIS. http://www.rawfoodexplained.com/science.html

If you haven't read these studies, than I URGE you to do so..
panacea
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed 23 Jun 2010 22:08

Re: A few questions!

Post by panacea »

A fact you will soon learn if you are to succeed in determining a more truthful view on nutrition is that almost all diet theories have studies and evidence for them being the holy grail or true. Logic, reasoning, evidence, etc, all comes in different degrees. For example someone backup up an all vegetarian diet might argue that the wai diet (largely consisted of fruit) doesn't contain enough of this specific vitamin or something whereas vegetables have more of it. This logic is sound except there is so much counter-logic, such as the fact that our bodies can adapt to absorb more of a nutrient if we continually ingest a low amount of it, and that our body just needs what is necessary, and that too much can do harm, etc etc etc. It literally is a maze as is figuring out any real mystery in life to a high degree of interconnectedness - almost all people give up their search and settle for some idea which, if they kept checking to see if it didn't make sense, wouldn't be in their belief system for longer than a month tops.

Just some food for thought, my own logical evaluation of the Wai Diet has trumped all other diets I've researched which has to be almost ALL of the major ones and most of the bizarre ones. I can't really tell you the specifics as I can't even remember most of it in the front of my memory and it would probably be hard to understand and over 200 pages long with analogies and whatnot.

You'll just have to evaluate it the best you can yourself, always keep questioning.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

Also, when mentioning reasons to not eat vegetables, he says nothing about Romaine lettuce, celery, cabbages, etc.

Are those seriously bad? The biochemistry supports this?

Could man truly of evolved with so little fruit trees around? How could their be fruits for the entire year? How many months are fruit trees even in season?

You take one group of people and the trees near them, the trees only have so long until they are no longer producing fruit, not only that, what of the group eating all the fruit to soon? What of gathering foods... the foods going rotten, etc.

Aren't vegetables the answer to the down time? Man has the rare ability to grow food, to garden. How did man survive during winter on fruit alone? Without being able to harvest a lot of ground vegetables, etc.

How would their be enough fruit trees to go around in the perfect world?

FRUIT ORCHARDS SURROUNDED IN NEEM ORCHARDS!

Truly, this 'wai' of life was only prevalent in an eden like garden.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

Ah, thank you for your reply. Are you on this diet?

I'm really itching to know the cost, and what's up with the sugar, don't fruits give more than needed?

The thing is, wai seems to have a lot more resources going for him, but I don't know anything about wai, and thus I can not consider the source of the information which holds me off from making any decisions. The science is sound here and there, but it isn't ENOUGH information, just bits and pieces with some cons on some things and yet not the full view.


*edit* I have noticed that a lot of people have been through here, posted and vanished, so sorry about the barging in and what not.

It's a life change, well a short hop off of vegetables for me... if this is scientifically true.
panacea
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed 23 Jun 2010 22:08

Re: A few questions!

Post by panacea »

In the past, I would assume (this is not based on studies or anything) that we would've been a much smaller population and spread out like other primates. Other animals (like gorillas) are frugivores which is even more extreme than the wai diet so yes if it's possible now I'm sure it would have been in the past when there was even more plant life.

The wai diet can be expensive, but if you think about it your health will probably be cheaper in the long run from lack of medical bills and higher quality of life being able to progress in life with an advantage. For me it's also cheaper than a 'fast food diet', for what it's worth.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

Of course, does eating raw fish taste bad?

Also...the sample diet(closest to my own specifications), is this all I need each and every day to get 100% nutrient values and maintain/build muscle mass?
Male, 22, 1.77m/5'10.5", 59kg/130lbs, moderately active, 2950 kcal

1 apple
4 bananas
Sometimes alternate with 1/2 a melon and a couple of peaches with oil
2.5 Liters of Orange Juice in 5 bottles with two tablespoons of oil per bottle
6-7 yolks or 50 grams of Salmon
Sometimes an avocado

OJ is sipped over the course of hours.
panacea
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed 23 Jun 2010 22:08

Re: A few questions!

Post by panacea »

Kashoku wrote:Ah, thank you for your reply. Are you on this diet?

I'm really itching to know the cost, and what's up with the sugar, don't fruits give more than needed?

The thing is, wai seems to have a lot more resources going for him, but I don't know anything about wai, and thus I can not consider the source of the information which holds me off from making any decisions. The science is sound here and there, but it isn't ENOUGH information, just bits and pieces with some cons on some things and yet not the full view.


*edit* I have noticed that a lot of people have been through here, posted and vanished, so sorry about the barging in and what not.

It's a life change, well a short hop off of vegetables for me... if this is scientifically true.
The cost for me is about 10-11$ a day, no eating out and minimum luxuries (not the best salmon, but rather tilapia, and not the best organic eggs, just the white shelled ones.)

Yes I am on this diet.

Fruits do provide energy, the extra sugar is for pure energy (no nutrients) - mainly for when you are moving about and exercising, like at work. If you are completely sedentary (not good) I guess you wouldn't need the sugar much. In the Wai Diet we consume raw egg yolks primarily for a nutrient-sweep, raw fish for the omega fats, fruits for hydration and also nutrients on a spread out basis, and sugar for extra pure energy. Fiber and oil is optional and helps slow absorption, an important part of this diet is to spread out meals and make them small.

Wai is actually a woman I believe, RRM [or Thijs (his first name)] and Wai were the founding authors of this diet. Wai is gone now and RRM is the most active poster here. Another theory is that Wai is also RRM, I don't really know.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

RDA: FDA Men, 19-24YR, 72kg, 160lb, 177cm, 70in

Selection:
[Item-1] 1units of Apples (Malus sylvestris), no skin, [1],
[Item-2] 4units of Banana (Musa X paradisiaca), [1],
[Item-3] 2500ml (milliliters) of Orange juice (Citrus sinensis), fresh, not pasteurized, [1][2],
[Item-4] 50g (grams) of Salmon (Salmo salar), Atlantic wild, [1][2],
[Item-5] 1units of Avocados (Persea americana), California, [1].

Weight:......................................3439.0337g

Constituents...................................Quantity..............RDA

Water........................................2928.35260g ..............?g
Energy.......................................2061.62518kcal .....2900.00kcal
Protein quality...................................20.76%
Protein........................................36.93613g ..........58.00g
-Methionine.....................................0.49393g .......13mg/kg (FAO/WHO 85)
-Cysteine.......................................0.35816g .......13mg/kg (FAO/WHO 85)
Total lipid (Fat)..............................41.04536g ..............?g
Carbohydrate..................................413.60661g ..............?g
Fiber, total dietary...........................27.46906g ..............?g
-Fibre, wat. sol................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
-Fibre, wat. ins................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5

Minerals, and trace elements
Calcium, Ca...................................346.23371mg .......1200.00mg
Iron, Fe........................................9.22626mg .........10.00mg
Magnesium, Mg.................................513.91371mg ........350.00mg
Phosphorus, P.................................720.74573mg .......1200.00mg
Potassium, K.................................8587.64751mg .............?mg
Sodium, Na.....................................73.64033mg .............?mg
Zinc, Zn........................................3.16101mg .........15.00mg
Copper, Cu......................................2.26679mg .............?mg
Manganese, Mn...................................1.54324mg .............?mg
Selenium, Se....................................0.02644mg ..........0.07mg no data:5
Iodide, I.......................................0.04316mg ..........0.15mg no data:1,2,5
Cobalt, Co......................................0.00139mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,5
Chromium, Cr....................................0.02616mg .............?mg no data:1,2,4,5
Nickel, Ni......................................0.02716mg .............?mg no data:1,2,5
Fluoride, F.....................................0.03854mg .............?mg no data:1,2,5
Boron, B........................................2.63603mg .............?mg no data:1,2,5
Silicon, Si....................................26.41033mg .............?mg no data:1,2,5
Tin, Sn.........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Molybdenum, Mo..................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Vanadium, V.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Chloride.......................................99.40928mg .............?mg no data:1,2,4,5
Bromine, Br.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Aluminium, Al...................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Nitrite.........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Nitrate.........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Vitamins
Vitamin C, total ascorbic acid...............1369.75587mg .........60.00mg
Vitamin B1, Thiamin.............................2.88843mg ..........1.50mg
Vitamin B2, Riboflavin..........................1.67067mg ..........1.70mg
Vitamin B3, Niacin, Nicotinamide...............20.38274mg .........19.00mg
Vitamin B5, Pantothenic acid....................8.78245mg .............?mg
Vitamin B6, Pyridoxine..........................4.72685mg ..........2.00mg
Folate, total................................1001.17012mcg .......200.00mcg
-Folic acid (Vitamin B9)........................0.00000mcg ............?mcg
-Folate, food................................1001.17012mcg ............?mcg
-Folate, DFE.................................1001.17012mcg_DFE ........?mcg_DFE
Vitamin B-12....................................1.59000mcg .........2.00mcg
Vitamin A, IU................................6739.22751IU .............?IU
Vitamin A, RE.................................677.61675mcg_RE ...1000.00mcg_RE
Total carotenoids...............................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-alpha-carotene.................................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-beta-carotene..................................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-gamma-carotene.................................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-cryptoxanthin..................................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-mutatochrome...................................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-lycopene.......................................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-lutein+zeaxanthin..............................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Vitamin D.....................................120.00000IU ........400.00IU
Vitamin E.......................................9.64943mg_ATE .....10.00mg_ATE
Vitamin H, Biotin...............................0.00000mcg ............?mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Vitamin K.......................................0.00000mcg ........70.00mcg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Tocopherol, total...............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-Tocopherol, alpha..............................3.59260mg .............?mg no data:1,3,4
-Tocopherol, beta...............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-Tocopherol, gamma..............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-Tocopherol, delta..............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-Tocotrienol, alpha.............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
-Tocotrienol, beta..............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Biogenic amines
Serotonine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Tyramine........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Dopamine........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Noradrenaline...................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Tryptamine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Cadaverine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Histamine.......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Putrescine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Spermidine......................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Spermine........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Fruit acids
Salicylic acid..................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Volatile acid.................................340.08438mg .............?mg no data:1,2,4,5
Malic acid...................................3217.72151mg .............?mg no data:1,2,4,5
Citric acid.................................27729.95780mg .............?mg no data:1,2,4,5
Lactic acid.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Tartaric acid...................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Glycolic acid...................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Oxalic acid total...............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Oxalic acid soluble.............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Chlorogenic acid................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Quinic acid.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Gallic acid.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Succinic acid total.............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Acetic acid.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Ferulic acid....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Malonic acid....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Fumaric acid....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Pyruvic acid....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Oxaloacetic acid................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Alpha ketoglut. acid............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Caffeic acid....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Para-coumaric acid..............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Total sugar....................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Reducing sugar..................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Non reducing sugar..............................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Glucose........................................60.16877g ..............?g no data:1,2,4,5
Fructose.......................................73.24894g ..............?g no data:1,2,4,5
Lactose.........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Maltose.........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Galactose.......................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Sucrose.......................................112.48945g ..............?g no data:1,2,4,5
Xylose..........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Pentosan........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Hexosan.........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Pectin..........................................2.24978g ..............?g no data:1,2,4,5
Inositol........................................4.97046g ..............?g no data:1,2,4,5
Starch..........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Cellulose.......................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Polyuronic......................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Sorbitol........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Xylitol.........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Mannitol........................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
Myoinositol.....................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5

Lipids

Fatty acids, total saturated...................6.53752g ..............?g
4:0, butanoic, butyric, tetranoic...............0.00000g ..............?g no data:5
6:0, hexanoic, caproic..........................0.00000g ..............?g no data:5
8:0, octanoic, caprylic.........................0.00000g ..............?g no data:5
10:0, decanoic, capric..........................0.00472g ..............?g no data:5
12:0, dodecanoic, lauric........................0.01072g ..............?g no data:5
13:0, tridecanoic...............................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
14:0, tetradecanoic, myristic...................0.11010g ..............?g no data:5
15:0, pentadecyclic.............................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
16:0, hexadecanoic, palmitic....................5.96560g ..............?g
17:0, heptadecanoic, margaric...................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
18:0, octadecanoic, stearic.....................0.19238g ..............?g
20:0, eicosanoic, arachidic.....................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,5
22:0, docosanoic, behenic.......................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,5
24:0, tetracosanoic, lignoceric.................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,5

Fatty acids total monounsat...................21.59846g ..............?g
14:1............................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:2,5
15:1............................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
16:1, palmitoleic, undiff.......................1.27091g ..............?g
17:1............................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:1,2,3,4,5
18:1, oleic, undiff............................20.09377g ..............?g
20:1, eicosaenoic, arachidonic..................0.11150g ..............?g no data:5
22:1, erucic....................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:2,4,5
22:1 undifferentiated...........................0.13950g ..............?g no data:5
24:1, nervonic, selacholeic, undiff.............0.00000g ..............?g no data:2,4,5

Fatty acids, total polyunsat...................6.38340g ..............?g
18:2, linoleic, undifferentiated................4.52829g ..............?g
18:3, linolenic, undifferentiated...............0.81045g ..............?g
18:4............................................0.04150g ..............?g
20:2 n-6 c,c....................................0.00000g ..............?g no data:3,4
20:3 undifferentiated ..........................0.00000g ..............?g no data:3,4
20:4 undifferentiated...........................0.14215g ..............?g
20:5 n-3, eicosapentaenoic......................0.16050g ..............?g
22:5 n-3, docosapentaenoic......................0.14349g ..............?g
22:6 n-3, docosahexaenoic.......................0.55750g ..............?g

Total sterols..................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Cholesterol....................................27.50000mg .............?mg
Phytosterols...................................75.52000mg .............?mg no data:1,3,5
Stigmasterols...................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Campesterols....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Beta sistosterols...............................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Total purines..................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Adenine.........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Guanine.........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5

Others
Glutathione.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Lignin..........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Tannins.........................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5
Theobromine.....................................0.00000mg .............?mg no data:1,2,3,4,5


Just ran it through the calculator. His/her exact sample.
panacea
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed 23 Jun 2010 22:08

Re: A few questions!

Post by panacea »

Wait for RRM's reply to check if your nutrient requirement checks out.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

I see, they seem like very intelligent biochemists. How old is this diet then, 6 years? What's their actual degree of study? Current situations? I apologize if I am being to prying. Just considering the source.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

It looks like it's already a bit low, but does meet the 2k caloric standard, however it does not meet the amount it says it is, 2.9k. I'm not sure of the vitamin reqs, and the 0.0000s across the bottom, I assume those are plant based. But do receptors for them exist within our body?
panacea
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed 23 Jun 2010 22:08

Re: A few questions!

Post by panacea »

The source probably isn't going to comfort you that much - but it shouldn't matter since you can find 300 real doctors on google selling snake oil type diets like 'blood type diet'. Just look at the studies and logic instead. I don't know much about their official qualifications either.
Kashoku
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri 11 Feb 2011 02:22

Re: A few questions!

Post by Kashoku »

It's about the authenticity more than the comfort. I'm looking for truth in this human filled lie fest. In any case, what of carotene? No carrots? :V
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